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Help with ineffective rig.  Rate Topic 
 
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 Posted: Sun Aug 27th, 2017 04:37 am
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Barbelman
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Joined: Mon Mar 18th, 2013
Location: Bloemfontein, South Africa
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Mana: 
I do fine when using pop-ups, but not so great when using bottom baits. I've been told to keep it simple. So this is my simple rig. Yesterday I had 2 runs, but after picking up the rod, nothing. Was it just my unlucky day or can you see something seriously wrong with this rig that can be the reason? They lay so long so its such a deal-breaker when you miss them.
Bait is 2X 20mm boilies. Hooklink is Korda Dark Matter 20LB. Hook is a no 4 Gardner Mugga.

Attachment: My rig.jpg (Downloaded 197 times)

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 Posted: Sun Aug 27th, 2017 05:16 am
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Beeslek
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Joined: Wed Mar 7th, 2012
Location: Klerksdorp, South Africa
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Equipment: 12 ft graphites,Shimano reels.
Best Catch: Common carp,14,6 kg
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Mana: 
Not much wrong with your rig,but here's what I do.

1.I would make it a combi-link,a stiff boom section of 20-25cm,with only a 2-3cm soft braid section,and add a small 3mm shrink tube kicker on the hook eye.Add a large lump of tunsten putty where the stiff and soft section meets.

2.Move the tubing on the shank up over the bend of the hook,to right above the point.That transfers the weight of the bait to the hook point,helps it to turn over quicker.

3.That is a large bait,I would make the gap between the bait and the hook bend at least 10-15mm.That separation is needed to allow free movement of the hook.

That being said,this rig needs to tighten against the lead to make it 'flip and turn'.If the fish are feeding cautiously,they might not pick up a heavy bottom bait.The same might happen if you are feeding particles around this rig,they move very slowly when feeding on particles.For this rig to be at it's most effective,you need them feeding aggressively and moving quickly.

The rig I described above is known as the 'claw rig',or advanced bottom bait rig.It needs to be used in the right situation.I use it when feeding a wide spread of large boilies on a hard bottom,such as clean sand,gravel or clay.When feeding smaller baits such as particles or pellets,I would use a balanced bait on a blowback rig,much easier for fish to pick up.

Lastly,if your venue has lots of small fish,that might also cause missed bites,they might be too small to fit that large bait into their mouth.So they only pick up the bait and not the hook.I learned this when fishing the Vaal river,muddies love boilies but they have very small mouths.Drove me insane until I figured it out,caught one by accident after about 50 missed bites.Hooked behind the head.

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 Posted: Sun Aug 27th, 2017 05:29 am
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Barbelman
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Joined: Mon Mar 18th, 2013
Location: Bloemfontein, South Africa
Posts: 382
Equipment: Too much to remember now
Best Catch: Carp, 11.2KG. Barber, 12.7KG
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Mana: 
I also thought the baits are too big, untill I read there are guys using three 30mm boilies:) There are a lot of small carp where I fish, hence trying with this big bait. I've been catching 2kg carp with 15mm popups, so I thought about stepping it up. I will for sure make my hair a bit longer as per your suggestion, thank you Beeslek.

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 Posted: Sun Aug 27th, 2017 07:40 am
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Beeslek
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Location: Klerksdorp, South Africa
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Mana: 
Bigger baits will not really help to catch bigger fish.I have caught 5 kg carp on a 60mm tigernut cluster.Only way to select bigger fish is to pick a venue that contains a larger percentage of bigger fish.

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 Posted: Sun Aug 27th, 2017 08:06 am
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Barbelman
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Joined: Mon Mar 18th, 2013
Location: Bloemfontein, South Africa
Posts: 382
Equipment: Too much to remember now
Best Catch: Carp, 11.2KG. Barber, 12.7KG
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Mana: 
Beeslek wrote:
Bigger baits will not really help to catch bigger fish.I have caught 5 kg carp on a 60mm tigernut cluster.Only way to select bigger fish is to pick a venue that contains a larger percentage of bigger fish.

And to use better rigs:cool:
Unfortunately my venue does have LOTS of small fish.

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 Posted: Sun Aug 27th, 2017 09:10 am
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HennieB
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Mana: 
What size weight are you using?

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 Posted: Sun Aug 27th, 2017 10:02 am
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Barbelman
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Joined: Mon Mar 18th, 2013
Location: Bloemfontein, South Africa
Posts: 382
Equipment: Too much to remember now
Best Catch: Carp, 11.2KG. Barber, 12.7KG
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Mana: 
Not heavy. I am not using a full specimen rig. I used n nornal plastic bomb holder. I can see now that might also be part of the problem?

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 Posted: Mon Aug 28th, 2017 04:43 am
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HennieB
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Mana: 
I'm almost certain that could be a major problem. You can stick with the in-line setup but go up to say a 3oz weight or you could try a semi-fixed running rig.

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 Posted: Mon Aug 28th, 2017 05:41 am
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Fishpaste
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Mana: 
My Gallery: 
HennieB wrote:
I'm almost certain that could be a major problem. You can stick with the in-line setup but go up to say a 3oz weight or you could try a semi-fixed running rig. Agreed!

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 Posted: Mon Aug 28th, 2017 05:55 am
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Barbelman
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Joined: Mon Mar 18th, 2013
Location: Bloemfontein, South Africa
Posts: 382
Equipment: Too much to remember now
Best Catch: Carp, 11.2KG. Barber, 12.7KG
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Boat: None, only a radio control bait boat
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Mana: 
Thanks guys. The reason I stick with a free running rig is two-fold. Firstly is is the safest rig I know for the fish. Secondly I land more fish (conventional angling) than any friend or family member that catches with a semi-bolt rig (Rietvlei). But I am prepared to do it differently if a free running rig is not effective enough for bigger specimen carp. Perhaps their bigger tougher mouths need a weight to drive the point home.
I also thought if it was not perhaps a barbel? seeing it is said they with times only pick up the bait and first swim away before swallowing it. I wish I had a underwater camera.

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 Posted: Tue Aug 29th, 2017 12:56 pm
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Barbelman
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Joined: Mon Mar 18th, 2013
Location: Bloemfontein, South Africa
Posts: 382
Equipment: Too much to remember now
Best Catch: Carp, 11.2KG. Barber, 12.7KG
Favorite Fishing Spot: Private property
Boat: None, only a radio control bait boat
Club: No
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Mana: 
I have had a looked at the thread linked below. Post #1. I will be tying a rig like this to try. Do anyone have a photo of the rest of the rig? @MadCarper. It would be great, thanks.

http://www.sealine.co.za/view_topic.php?id=96943&forum_id=79

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 Posted: Mon Sep 11th, 2017 10:35 am
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Barbelman
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Joined: Mon Mar 18th, 2013
Location: Bloemfontein, South Africa
Posts: 382
Equipment: Too much to remember now
Best Catch: Carp, 11.2KG. Barber, 12.7KG
Favorite Fishing Spot: Private property
Boat: None, only a radio control bait boat
Club: No
Status: 
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Mana: 
Beeslek
Lastly,if your venue has lots of small fish,that might also cause missed bites,they might be too small to fit that large bait into their mouth.So they only pick up the bait and not the hook.I learned this when fishing the Vaal river,muddies love boilies but they have very small mouths.Drove me insane until I figured it out,caught one by accident after about 50 missed bites.Hooked behind the head.

You were 100% correct with this statement it seems. I got another run, nothing. So I reeled in and to my surprise found a scale on the hook, belonging to maybe a 1.5 to 3.0 kg carp.
It makes me sad as I thought big double boilies will be the thing I needed to up my game.

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 Posted: Wed Sep 13th, 2017 03:12 pm
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Beeslek
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Joined: Wed Mar 7th, 2012
Location: Klerksdorp, South Africa
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Best Catch: Common carp,14,6 kg
Favorite Fishing Spot: Vaal river
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Mana: 
As I said before,bigger baits will not necessarily catch you bigger fish.The only sure way to avoid small fish is to select a venue with a lesser percentage of small fish.

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 Posted: Thu Sep 14th, 2017 12:27 pm
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KUSAF
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Mana: 
Just strip the coating off to about 1cm from hook eye and straighten the hooklink either by steam or some rubbing under tension say over your leg. The tubing on the hook you can adjust that the hair kicks from the bait inline with the hook point. Otherwise everything seems ok. Overall hooklink length keep at between 17cm and 22cm

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 Posted: Thu Sep 14th, 2017 12:27 pm
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KUSAF
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Mana: 
Just strip the coating off to about 1cm from hook eye and straighten the hooklink either by steam or some rubbing under tension say over your leg. The tubing on the hook you can adjust that the hair kicks from the bait inline with the hook point. Otherwise everything seems ok. Overall hooklink length keep at between 17cm and 22cm

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