SEALINE - South African Angling and Boating Community Home 
Home Recent Search search Menu menu Not logged in - Login | Register


 Moderated by: Emperor
New Topic Reply Printer Friendly
Butt cat 18ft6  Rate Topic 
 
AuthorPost
 Posted: Mon Aug 12th, 2019 07:06 pm
  PM Quote Reply
1st Post
Big Mic
Senior Member


Joined: Wed Sep 24th, 2008
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Posts: 681
Equipment: Custom Purglas 400/8 + TN 50, Assassin Blade (std) , ...
Best Catch: *
Favorite Fishing Spot: False Bay. Struisbaai . Morgans bay
Boat: *
Club: Tygerberg Angling Club
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Hi Gents

I've recently taken on a new project - that being an old butt cat 18ft6 that I would like to rebuild. This would be the first time doing a boat refurb so any advice especially from guys that have done similar builds would be great..

First things I need to attend and have questions about are :

1. New deck - should I use marine ply with glass or nidacore? Any tips especially for working with nidacore would be much appreciated..

2. I suspect the original foam is waterlogged and I would obviously want to redo this - should I replace it with PU foam or go with sondor foam? I'm leaning towards the latter as I like the idea that the sondor does not take on any water or get saturated should any water find itself inside the hull.

Question - Does the PU foam offer structural support hence the reason it is used by the manufacturer AND if so and I use sondor instead would I need to add additional transverse and longitudinal framework/bulkheads under deck to increase structural support with absence of the PU foam.

3. Would it be advisable to reinforce the inside of the hull with a layer of fiberglass or maybe a coating of pool coat? Maybe both?

Any advice or ideas would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance

Mic

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Mon Aug 12th, 2019 08:00 pm
  PM Quote Reply
2nd Post
Dr halibut hoffman
Sealiner


Joined: Wed Sep 16th, 2009
Location: Cape, South Africa
Posts: 2294
Equipment: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...
Best Catch: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...145cm FL Leervis released (Shore), 80kg+ yellowfin (Boat). 83cm Cracker. ...
Favorite Fishing Spot: Kranse en diepsee!
Boat: 15' Skicraft cat.Canoe.
Club: Ike jime,no club
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
My Gallery: 
Not that I know anything but apparently Len @ Butt Cat is very helpful with rebuilds..and a great guy.

http://www.buttcatsales.co.za/contact-us
I know that I fish off a few..one a brand-new/second-hand rebuild that they did themselves in PE ..what a pleasure!

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Tue Aug 13th, 2019 08:07 am
  PM Quote Reply
3rd Post
willem wikkel spies
Moderator


Joined: Tue Apr 29th, 2008
Location: Heidelberg, South Africa
Posts: 3915
Equipment: ekt geleer net die beste werk.............................
Best Catch: eish waar begin ek?
Favorite Fishing Spot: noord van die tugela is goed genoeg
Boat: Kosi cat 16; 2x 60 mercs
Club: nooooit nie
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Big Mic wrote:
Hi Gents

I've recently taken on a new project - that being an old butt cat 18ft6 that I would like to rebuild. This would be the first time doing a boat refurb so any advice especially from guys that have done similar builds would be great..

First things I need to attend and have questions about are :

1. New deck - should I use marine ply with glass or nidacore? Any tips especially for working with nidacore would be much appreciated..

2. I suspect the original foam is waterlogged and I would obviously want to redo this - should I replace it with PU foam or go with sondor foam? I'm leaning towards the latter as I like the idea that the sondor does not take on any water or get saturated should any water find itself inside the hull.

Question - Does the PU foam offer structural support hence the reason it is used by the manufacturer AND if so and I use sondor instead would I need to add additional transverse and longitudinal framework/bulkheads under deck to increase structural support with absence of the PU foam.

3. Would it be advisable to reinforce the inside of the hull with a layer of fiberglass or maybe a coating of pool coat? Maybe both?

Any advice or ideas would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance

Mic


MY 2cents!!!

1. nicadore seems to be the in thing as it cannot rot.
but a properly treated marine ply which was sealed with resin should outlast most things.

2. pu foam is good, but sealing the hull is where most f ups come in.
pu foam does add strength and stiffness to the hull.
sondor is loose sections so no adding of strength to the hull.
so adding cross bars etc will be a benefit.

3. I would even go to 2x layers even 3x, you are not adding so much weight so the added extra layers will add strength to the hull.
pool coat is similar to gel coat.
it is very hard and it does crack easily if not supported.
so just normal 2x layers of fabric would be good.

adding 50 kg or even 80kg to the existing hull on improvements will not make a huge difference.
adding such weight on a small 12ft vessel is a big problem.

also do take a look on http://www.boatfishing.co.za

builds have been done there and also lots of knowledge there

but do keep the updates going here, we all can learn from it

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Tue Aug 13th, 2019 10:00 am
  PM Quote Reply
4th Post
Big Mic
Senior Member


Joined: Wed Sep 24th, 2008
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Posts: 681
Equipment: Custom Purglas 400/8 + TN 50, Assassin Blade (std) , ...
Best Catch: *
Favorite Fishing Spot: False Bay. Struisbaai . Morgans bay
Boat: *
Club: Tygerberg Angling Club
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Thanks for the replies and advice gents - I will keep updating as I go _seal1_

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Tue Aug 13th, 2019 06:27 pm
  PM Quote Reply
5th Post
D5
Senior Member
 

Joined: Sat Oct 3rd, 2009
Location: JHB, South Africa
Posts: 305
Equipment: Shimano, Sonik , ABU,
Best Catch: 10kg common , 18.5 kg Cat
Favorite Fishing Spot: Tago
Boat: No
Club: no
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
I was today at AMT composites in Joburg .
You also have a one in Cape Town . Do it right from beginning, go and see what they have there for deck and rest . That composite material ( not nidacore - forgot name ) - It’s amazingly light - at least 3-4 times lighter then wood and very strong . It costs but the lighter boat you make the better will be ( better ride and smaller outboards ) and it does not rot . I would forget about wood - it’s just pain to seal it and it’s far too heavy. If you can get Italian plywood - that is than different story . Butt Cat is all about being light. So don’t make it heavy like a Snake Cat ;)

For that hull you need to use bonding foam and that is a PU closed cell foam . I agree with Willem add two layers of fiberglass . They have different types of glass and they will advise you also which weave is better for that application .
They have all what you need in one shop . Rollers , fiberglass , acetone, foam , fairing compound ... etc .

Good luck - it’s a huge job you doing , but go slow and take time. Remove deck and all foam - make new stringers and so on .... Friend and myself are re doing deck on Seacat - sanding , fixing all crap job by boat builder and previous owner . Preparing for Line-X deck coat . Job just does not end . But that is when you owe the boat . But at the end you will do a proper job without taking shortcuts and your boat will last you for long . What I have seen in past I came to conclusion that no boat Bulider can do better job then myself, neither I will ask any of them anymore to do anything on my boat as I have seen *** job like you cannot believe . Internet and Sealine is your best friend and best knowledge base - rest is your elbow grease and healthy Bank account .
Just my 2c

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Wed Aug 14th, 2019 07:37 am
  PM Quote Reply
6th Post
A1ex
Member


Joined: Tue Dec 7th, 2010
Location: Noordhoek, Cape Town, South Africa
Posts: 293
Equipment: Penn, Shimano.
Best Catch: A periwinkel. 350lb Black Marlin.
Favorite Fishing Spot: Mozambique, Breede/Cape Infanta and off cape point
Boat: Navarone 17ft
Club: The Ocean
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Pm me, I see we in the same area, I dont mind coming around and giving some advice on your build!

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Wed Aug 14th, 2019 09:09 am
  PM Quote Reply
7th Post
willem wikkel spies
Moderator


Joined: Tue Apr 29th, 2008
Location: Heidelberg, South Africa
Posts: 3915
Equipment: ekt geleer net die beste werk.............................
Best Catch: eish waar begin ek?
Favorite Fishing Spot: noord van die tugela is goed genoeg
Boat: Kosi cat 16; 2x 60 mercs
Club: nooooit nie
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
the best would be to use epoxy and not polyester resin!!!

epoxy does not absorb water at all.
but too expensive.

but on the inside of a hull it is not needed as no water should be present inside the hull

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Wed Aug 14th, 2019 11:19 am
  PM Quote Reply
8th Post
Fin-S
Sealiner
 

Joined: Mon Nov 26th, 2007
Location: Gordons Bay, Cape Town, South Africa
Posts: 1448
Equipment: Tackle tart
Best Catch: Good fishing mates
Favorite Fishing Spot: Remote locations in Africa
Boat: StealthCat, 2 x Suzuki 4's
Club: IGFA
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
1. New deck - should I use marine ply with glass or nidacore? Any tips especially for working with nidacore would be much appreciated..
Nidacore or a similar honeycomb material. Layer both sides with glass and remember to put in backing plates where necessary.

2. I suspect the original foam is waterlogged and I would obviously want to redo this - should I replace it with PU foam or go with sondor foam? I'm leaning towards the latter as I like the idea that the sondor does not take on any water or get saturated should any water find itself inside the hull.
I suggest bottles in plastic nets along the keels and then Sondor blocks on top.

Question - Does the PU foam offer structural support hence the reason it is used by the manufacturer AND if so and I use sondor instead would I need to add additional transverse and longitudinal framework/bulkheads under deck to increase structural support with absence of the PU foam.
Foam does not offer much structural support. It does lend some rigidity but you should be adding stringers.

3. Would it be advisable to reinforce the inside of the hull with a layer of fiberglass or maybe a coating of pool coat? Maybe both?
Yes - even 2 layers would be OK

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Thu Aug 15th, 2019 06:30 pm
  PM Quote Reply
9th Post
Big Mic
Senior Member


Joined: Wed Sep 24th, 2008
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Posts: 681
Equipment: Custom Purglas 400/8 + TN 50, Assassin Blade (std) , ...
Best Catch: *
Favorite Fishing Spot: False Bay. Struisbaai . Morgans bay
Boat: *
Club: Tygerberg Angling Club
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
Hi Gents

Thanks a mil for the responses - really did not expect so much feed back!

I've got a fairly good idea about how and what I would like done with the rebuild.

I've decided on 2 layers of glass on hull inner, nidacore and glass for the stringers and bulkheads and then nidacore decking.

I am still in 2 minds about what floatation I should use...I will do some more research and decide upon an option...I think there is plenty time to decide before we get to the point where foam needs to be added.

Also I've decided not to take this project on alone and will be having a local boat builder be doing some of the work and will assist where I can and be as involved as possible in the project.

I will be taking the butt cat into the work yard next week and will update from there..

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  

 Posted: Thu Aug 15th, 2019 06:34 pm
  PM Quote Reply
10th Post
Big Mic
Senior Member


Joined: Wed Sep 24th, 2008
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Posts: 681
Equipment: Custom Purglas 400/8 + TN 50, Assassin Blade (std) , ...
Best Catch: *
Favorite Fishing Spot: False Bay. Struisbaai . Morgans bay
Boat: *
Club: Tygerberg Angling Club
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
This is what she currently looks like - first thing I will be doing is cutting the chariot / fwd console off.

Attachment: IMG_20190812_164701.jpg (Downloaded 23 times)

Back To Top PM Quote Reply

 Posted: Thu Aug 15th, 2019 07:19 pm
  PM Quote Reply
11th Post
willem wikkel spies
Moderator


Joined: Tue Apr 29th, 2008
Location: Heidelberg, South Africa
Posts: 3915
Equipment: ekt geleer net die beste werk.............................
Best Catch: eish waar begin ek?
Favorite Fishing Spot: noord van die tugela is goed genoeg
Boat: Kosi cat 16; 2x 60 mercs
Club: nooooit nie
Status: 
Offline
Mana: 
if you search this forum you will see that way back Fanie advised using sondor foam.
only later did the guys see the value in his post.

in any case,

sondor foam does not absorb any water and it will not rot.
so this will allow you to have bungs in the hull.
as soon as a water leak is detected one can attend to it.
the hull can still drain the water out the bungs!!!

pu foam will absorb water when the seal is broken.
and it only becomes worse.

and don't worry about having proper bottels!!!
if you like.
and don't worry about holing your hull.
to hole a hull is not easily done.
take a hammer to a hull and see if you can penetrate it?

to make a big enough hole, for bottels to float out...….I would not think that you would still be on the boat.
you would be flying through the sky if you manage to hole the hull big enough for bottles to escape.

it is said, that most of the leaks are from above deck and not the keel strips as such.
keel strips, through the screws over time with beech work.

but it is your decision at the end of the day.

but keep posting the pics and work done, we all can learn through this exercise!!!

all the best

Back To Top PM Quote Reply  


Current time is 05:26 pm  
SEALINE - South African Angling and Boating Community > Boating > Starboard > Butt cat 18ft6 Top