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Should Seine Netting be Banned?
   
   
   
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Banning of Seine Netting  Rating:  Rating
 
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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 08:12 am $report_button
   
21st Post
jb2
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Mana: 
RobinF wrote: Hi MISA,

If you are asking me to give you proof of the 115+ Garrick, I cannot. I have three people that witnessed the capture and one witnessed the sale. Their account of this incident are all the same. But, they refuse to give formal statements because they park their vehicles right outside the netter's facility and as such are afraid. I can't force these guys. Some of the guys have had calls late at night and some get quietly told to be careful or else. It's so difficult for them. And thus, that is why so many are so quiet. You yourself have noticed that they are so quiet, right? Ask yourself why that is? The answer becomes obvious. Most have families, so I cannot blame them.

What I do know is that a lot of issues that arise with this netter and his catches are conveniently rubbed out. Corruption? According to what I have been told, it appears so. Proof? No.

As you know, this is all about tradition, the handing down of the lic from father to son. I do think that as a start, they should revoke any lic where the guys are catching illegally. I will never believe that any netter has his lic because of race. Maybe I am naive like that, but for me I am completely colour-blind (Figuratively).

Regards
Robin


Hi Robin

All commercial fishing rights allocations in South Africa are based on race.

In fisheries controlled by total allowable catch such as pilchards, hake, kreef, etc., your percentage of black shareholding and management and procurement is directly related to how much fish you are allowed to catch.

In effort controlled fishing, you compete for a restricted number of units of effort. So if only 20 boats may be employed, the companies with the 20 highest scores for black shareholding and management will usually outscore comparable applications where transformation is lower.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 08:20 am $report_button
   
22nd Post
RobinF
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Mana: 
Hi JB2,

Thanks for that. I actually never knew that. See why polls like this are important?

Just to go back to something, I did not start this poll to rile up emotions, that would imply that I am causing trouble, this poll is about a real concern for many. It just so happens to hit that proverbial nerve for many. And it is interesting to see the different views. I under no circumstance am a professional, so it's also educational for me too and I learn more from each member that contributes.

Regards
Robin

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 08:30 am $report_button
   
23rd Post
jb2
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Mana: 
RobinF wrote: Hi JB2,

Thanks for that. I actually never knew that. See why polls like this are important?

Just to go back to something, I did not start this poll to rile up emotions, that would imply that I am causing trouble, this poll is about a real concern for many. It just so happens to hit that proverbial nerve for many. And it is interesting to see the different views. I under no circumstance am a professional, so it's also educational for me too and I learn more from each member that contributes.

Regards
Robin

Hi Robin

I am not sure that the poll itself is of any value but I think that open robust discussion is incredibly important.

The reason that I suggested the right questions to ask was to give you some guidance on how to go about investigating stuff.

Just to give you an idea about how central race is to rights allocations, it is worth having a look at the section of the Marine Living Resources Act that deals with Race.

Have a look at the section below:

Granting of rights


18. (1) No person shall undertake commercial fishing or subsistence fishing, engage


in mariculture or operate a fish processing establishment unless a right to undertake or


engage in such an activity or to operate such an establishment has been granted to such


a person by the Minister.


(2) An application for any right referred to in subsection (1) shall be submitted to the


Minister in the manner that the Minister may determine.


(3) The Minister may require an environmental impact assessment report to be


submitted by the applicant.


(4) Unless otherwise determined by the Minister in relation to the holders of existing


rights, only South African persons shall acquire or hold rights in terms of this section.


(5) In granting any right referred to in subsection (1), the Minister shall, in order to achieve the objectives contemplated in section 2, have particular regard to the need to permit new entrants, particularly those from historically disadvantaged sectors of society.


(6) All rights granted in terms of this section shall be valid for the period determined


by the Minister, which period shall not exceed 15 years, whereafter it shall automatically


terminate and revert back to the State to be reallocated in terms of the provisions of this


Act relating to the allocation of such rights.


(7) The Minister may determine sustainable conservation and management measures,


including the use of a particular type of vessel or gear, or area of fishing, to which a right


may be subject.


 

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 08:42 am $report_button
   
24th Post
Echo7
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Mana: 
I think the poll was brilliant!!

We got a pretty good indication of how people perceive this issue.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 08:43 am $report_button
   
25th Post
MISA
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Mana: 
jb2 I suspected as much thus I only questioned it..

RobinF I am almost willing to bet if something was done to pull the licence it would end up heading towards the constitution courts...

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 09:07 am $report_button
   
26th Post
Marthin
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Mana: 
JB correct me if im wrong but wasnt there a kinda ultimatum set for the cape town trekkers to either keep to the regulations or face the music?

This has no doubt led to Naartjie giving a crewmember a warm ear with some sort of implement on 2 occasions that i know of.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 09:22 am $report_button
   
27th Post
jb2
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Mana: 
Marthin wrote: JB correct me if im wrong but wasnt there a kinda ultimatum set for the cape town trekkers to either keep to the regulations or face the music?

This has no doubt led to Naartjie giving a crewmember a warm ear with some sort of implement on 2 occasions that i know of.


Hi Marthin

There have been a series of meetings with the False Bay treknetters. They meet twice a year with the fisheries manager and he does read them the riot act from time to time.

There are representatives from compliance (inspectors) at the meeting and they speak quite frankly about what they have in miind if there are transgressions.

The crew smokkel is a problem and it has been suggested that Naartjie taps them with the plank that he uses as a measuring board if they get out of line. (For "tap" read "moers them stukkend like its the last over of a 20/20 match!")

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 09:31 am $report_button
   
28th Post
Marthin
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Mana: 
Something like that just needs to be implemented at durban and i can't see how it can be an issue.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 09:41 am $report_button
   
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Echo7
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Mana: 
In Durban there is a lack of will and resolve (AKA balls) by the authorities, coupled with the fact that the habitual offender in question has numerous highly placed contacts to bail him out of trouble.

This offender is an extremely unsavoury character who likes dressing up in military -like garb and comands a small army of associates who are well connected to the underworld. All protected by a pretty effecient legal team.

So long story short, while we debate this to enternity, the fact remains that Robin who is in Cape Town actually DID something that the cuzzies in sleepy hollow (Durban) couldn't.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 11:34 am $report_button
   
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CLS
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Mana: 
We are doing something in Durban. I say ban the licence for the area if its being abused.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 11:35 am $report_button
   
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CLS
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Mana: 
We are doing something in Durban.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 11:35 am $report_button
   
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CLS
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Mana: 
We are doing something in Durban.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 11:36 am $report_button
   
33rd Post
CLS
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Mana: 
We are doing something in Durban.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 11:38 am $report_button
   
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Echo7
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Mana: 
I know YOU are helping CLS, will come see you when I'm back in Durbs.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 11:50 am $report_button
   
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RobinF
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Mana: 
Echo, as you know, if it was not for CLS mantioning the Garrick, I would not have been involved. (Should I be saying that?)   :uzi:uzi:uzi:uziCLS


I'll remove that if you want.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 12:06 pm $report_button
   
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CLS
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Mana: 
No sweat, slowly slowly catch the culprit

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 12:32 pm $report_button
   
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BulkCarrier
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Mana: 
For me you must classify gill netting and trek netting in different categories.

Gill netting is evil because they catch eveything and stay in the water for days/months.

Treknetting only catch fish that is in that area for the 30 min they are setting the net. Might have a whole school or nothing.

Will vote to ban gill netting, but treknetting is better fishing practice and just as bad as 20 anglers with rod and reel.

RobinF wrote:
Fin-S, Thanks for the vote:

IOL news article 22 December 2011 - "In recent weeks, he has had several confrontations with Ezemvelo KZN Wildlife officials, who bust him for allegedly netting banned fish. It is also believed Ezemvelo has recommended to the Department of Sea Fisheries that seine netting be banned."

Fin-S, please don't get me wrong, I totally respect your views. Thanks again for voting.

 

Fin-S wrote: To date I have seen no CONCLUSIVE PROOF of the netters breaking the law. There has been lots of hearsay, lots of heavy breathing, fire and damnation stuff....but no proof.
As a result I vote no.
If you can prove that the law has been contravened, then I would remove this persons right to fish - I would still not ban netting completely.
A ban is an easy way out and is the thin end of the wedge.
Look at coppers.....
My worry is that once we get onto a roll of banning, there is little knowledge or desire from our Ministerial component to investigate other conservation alternatives. It will therefore not be long before any infringement is met with a total ban.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 12:43 pm $report_button
   
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RobinF
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Mana: 
Hi BulkCarrier,

Gill nets are a monster, what this poll is about is your second suggestion. The dropping of nets, encircling the fish and essentially pulling that to shore. The 'treknetting' has it's own evil in that it scoops up everything not small enough to get through the netting holes. Your imagination will tell you what can happen from there.

It's good to have you voting, go for it.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 01:02 pm $report_button
   
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Echo7
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Mana: 
Fin-S wrote: To date I have seen no CONCLUSIVE PROOF of the netters breaking the law. There has been lots of hearsay, lots of heavy breathing, fire and damnation stuff....but no proof.

 

I'm assuming then that the burden of proof rests with the accusers? By that logic there would be no whistleblowers on matters of corruption, no tip offs from members of the public about crimes unless prima facie evidence is provided. If one applies that to real life, no crimes would be solved unless a policeman was there while the offence is being commited.

A number of people have reported the same person for the same offences a number of times, the same way a group of concerned neighbours would complain if they suspected a private home in their area was being run as a brothel. It would be beyond the capability for an ordinary person to gather such evidence (in the interest of marital bliss). That duty would rest on the police, who no doubt take a VERY active interest in brothels.

The point is the authorities should have taken action long ago, the question is why are they so reluctant?

 

 

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 Posted: Wed Dec 5th, 2012 01:09 pm $report_button
   
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RobinF
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Mana: 
What an EPIC comparison. True, but what an example to use! Thanks Echo, I nearly wet myself laughing at that.

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